Whenever I open a new application, the old application disappears and I am unable to retrieve it with two "exceptions".

The first exception is when I have an application open and open another program like Freecell. In this instance I have no problems switching back-and-forth.

The second one is unusual. I have a screen saver on the computer. Whenever I go to click (or merely move) the mouse to restore the screen, the screen saver will be minimized as well as sometimes up to 3 or 4 blank windows. But get this: if I go to open an application (with the 3 or 4 blank minimized windows), it will make the old application disappear and unretrievable.

What can I do to keep more than one application (other than Freecell; something large that would take up an entire screen) up without losing the other one?

Are the old versions that you speak of gone completely? Can you see them if you use "ALT-TAB"? This is really some strange behavior. Can't say that I have seen it before.

What OS is this?

Originally posted by Shakey
Are the old versions that you speak of gone completely? Can you see them if you use "ALT-TAB"? This is really some strange behavior. Can't say that I have seen it before.

What OS is this?

I have Windows 98, 2nd edition. I tried the Alt-Tab function but no avail. I guess the word "task" is a better phrase to use than "application".

I notice this happens especially when I try to use two types of internet-related tasks (e.g. this and something like Google). Shouldn't I still be able to maintain both screens without losing the other? I have no problem opening another task along with Freecell (maybe other computer-related tasks as well--I'm not sure). This morning I didn't get 3 or 4 blank minimized windows--this happens sometimes--I only had one plus the minimized screen saver.

I'm just guessing, but it sounds like you are nearing a reinstall. The longest I have ever seen 98 go without a reinstall was a year and a half.

If you have problems opening windows, or makes other windows disappear and you can't get them back, there are only so many things you can do.

Run SFC and see if there are any corrupt files.

Run a thorough scan disk and have it repair any errors.

Both of these might not fix anything, but it never hurts to try. I have had problems similar to what you describe, and ultimately all I could do with constant window problems was reinstall.

Just some thoughts...

Scan Disk sounds like a good idea, may I suggest Norton Utilities ... You get a good speed disk (that can actually optimize your swap file) and various tools to fix problems & maintain your system. Norton always worked like a charm for me.

Remember to back up all your important files Boogle (like your emus and roms) before reinstalling.

BTW Aaron wouldn't a f disk be better to make sure everything is cleaned out and then do a fresh install ????

Now here comes something scary ... I've had Win ME (YES! Win ME) on my cpu for over a year now, in all that time I've experienced only 6-7 BSODs and no lack of speed yet, and this feat has been achieved on a measly a ASUS A7V motherboard with a 750mhz AMD Duron processor & 256 mb ram (pc133). Statistically this should've crashed a long time ago, go figure....

Originally posted by 80sSmurf
Scan Disk sounds like a good idea, may I suggest Norton Utilities ... You get a good speed disk (that can actually optimize your swap file) and various tools to fix problems & maintain your system. Norton always worked like a charm for me.

BTW Aaron wouldn't a f disk be better to make sure everything is cleaned out and then do a fresh install ????

Now here comes something scary ... I've had Win ME (YES! Win ME) on my cpu for over a year now, in all that time I've experienced only 6-7 BSODs and no lack of speed yet, and this feat has been achieved on a measly a ASUS A7V motherboard with a 750mhz AMD Duron processor & 256 mb ram (pc133). Statistically this should've crashed a long time ago, go figure....

Norton is pretty good too. Without seeing these problems first hand, it is really hard to say exactly what to do.

As for fdisk, not necessarily. If you format your drive, you are just deleting the FAT table, but that's all you need. A friend of mine believes in always running fdisk first, but I never do. So far I've never had a problem with it.

If you want to make damn sure everything is gone, bye bye, no more, just low level format the hard disk. The difference is that fdisk kills the partition. It doesn't format the drive, but theres no partition so you might as well consider it formatted, because you will have to format afterwards. Low level format writes zeros to the entire drive. You can only low level format with special utilities, like those that come from Seagate, Western Digital, etc, although some third party utilities can do it as well.

High level formatting, which is what DOS/Windows does, just kills the FAT table. In essence, your index of files is gone, so you might as well figure everything is gone. You can unerase files, but it isn't easy and doesn't always work.

BTW Smurfie... I have no idea what a BSOD is. Maybe I've heard the full term though... :confused:

Thanks for the tips, guys:thumb: I still have a few questions:

What is SFC? Is it located in scandisk? Would disk cleanup accomplish anything? Should I back up any important files before running any of the above mentioned (other than fdisk; which I assume means format the hard drive)?

If you have to reinstall, you might try this. As soon as the install finishes and you get to the desktop, immediately right click My Computer. Then click Properties. Then click the Device Manager tab. From there, click the Performance tab, then click File System button. Finally, click the Troubleshooting tab. Put a check mark in "Disable write behind caching for all drives". Then click OK. Then keep clicking OK or Close until you see a prompt asking you to restart your machine. Once it is restarted, go online and go to the Windows Update site. Make sure you get the Cache Package update (or something like that). It sounds like when you shut down your PC, not all of the data is being written to the disk from the cache. Install that update, as well as the critical updates. Once the updates are installed and the machine restarted, you can then go back to Device Manager and remove the check mark from "Disable write behind caching from all drives", although I have mine still set to disable, because I have yet to see any benefit from enabling it. I hope that helps.

Originally posted by Boggle
Thanks for the tips, guys:thumb: I still have a few questions:

What is SFC? Is it located in scandisk? Would disk cleanup accomplish anything? Should I back up any important files before running any of the above mentioned (other than fdisk; which I assume means format the hard drive)?

System File Checker. It does a CRC check (I believe) on various system files to find out if they are corrupt and lets you restore them from CAB files. It's not bulletproof, and it's not perfect, but its better than nothing.

SFC and scandisk are totally separate utilities.

All disk cleanup does (for the most part) is deletes the files on your recycle bin. I don't even let them get that far. I hold down shift as I'm clicking delete and they are immediately deleted.

As for the write behind caching, that might be the deal. Honestly I have never used those caching features. Most drives have a 2 MB cache on them, which is immediately written. The deal is, when you turn on/off an option under Windows, it is written to the registry right then, but Windows won't read everything on the fly, hence a reboot is required.

Personally, I don't think it's a caching problem, but by all means, try it out. Worst that it will do is nothing.

Most problems within Windows are caused by Windows, not hardware. My 98 has problems all the time, but 2000 and Linux RARELY have problems. All my hardware is high end too. Windows 98 is just very poorly designed.

One final comment. Hurricane mentioned the caching update from Microsoft. If memory serves me, that update is only is you have several drives mapped. I can't say for 100% positive, but I'm not so sure that will fix the problem.

Maybe I'm just thinking of a different patch...

Where do I find the system file checker? I'll try running scandisk (after running system file checker) and see what it does. Doesn't fdisk wipe out the entire hard drive?

Originally posted by Boggle
Where do I find the system file checker? I'll try running scandisk (after running system file checker) and see what it does. Doesn't fdisk wipe out the entire hard drive?

Start > Run > SFC

It might be under \windows or \windows\command, I really don't remember off hand. Running it as above works fine.

As for fdisk... yes and no. It doesn't format or delete the contents of your drive, it kills and creates partitions. But after you have killed the partition, files are pretty much gone. You MIGHT be able to recover files you kill a partition with fdisk, but I have never heard of it done before.

All fdisk does is creates and deletes partitions (including extended partitions), and sets an active (boot) partition.

If your MBR (Master Boot Record) is hosed, you can always use fdisk /mbr to rebuilt it. I don't use it much.

So technically speaking, no it doesn't wipe out the drive, but after you kill a partition, you might as well have formatted it because the data is basically gone. However, once you partition it, a fresh format is required.

I use fdisk all the time with new drives. I never use that crap that the drive manufacturers include. Using fdisk ain't rocket science.

The Cache Update is to address newer, faster computers with large hard disk buffers. It doesn't matter how many drives you have mapped. What happens is without the patch, the buffer doesn't have time to write everything to the hard drive before the system shuts down. When you install the update, it adds a few seconds to the shutdown process, enabling the cache to finish writing everything from the hard drive buffer. I have the update, but I also have write behind caching disabled to ensure that all data is written to the hard drive. No harm is done by disabling it. It might slow down the OS a tad, but most people don't even notice it. At least everything will get written to the hard drive. :)

Hmmm I've never heard of that patch then I guess. I have caching enabled and I don't have this problem. My machine is 800 mhz and I have a 7200 rpm drive using with Windows 98 and 2000, and I have never had caching problems.

The more I think about it, I've never heard of this happening before. Linux does a LOT of caching, but it writes every so many seconds, not in one big chunk.

I question that update though. I'm not saying your wrong Hurricane, but if that is the explanation off Microsofts site (which it sounds like), I severely doubt it. The shutdown process always last several seconds, and even adding a few seconds to the shutdown will not give enough time for upwards of 2 MB of caching to be written to the drive.

Again, nothing against you at all. This sounds like something Microsoft coughed up and I think its rather lame. In other words, I'm having a *very* hard time buying it.

Do you believe what Microsoft is telling you? :rolleyes:

All I can say for sure is that the cache update worked for me. My Windows Me operating system has yet to be reinstalled, and it's been well over 2 years. So the cache update does indeed fix the problem.

At this point, I would say try any of these suggestions. It really doesn't sound like you have a lot to lose. This just sounds like one of those issues that is hard to trouble shoot without being in front of the system. It happens... Sorry, I couldn't be of more help.

Originally posted by aaronw
... BTW Smurfie... I have no idea what a BSOD is. Maybe I've heard the full term though... :confused:

I'm surprised you never heard this term before Aaron ... BSOD = Blue Screen Of Death .... I don't think I need to explain what that is ;) :D

BTW I'm just like you're friend. When WinME finally crashes (which is just as inevitable as death and taxes) I too will run a fdisk and start a clean install ... I don't have too much faith in M$ as it is, and I'm sure just reinstalling isn't gonna cut it, too many quirks and instability will follow in the slipstream of the reinstall :)

DAVID!!!
It's very important that you back up all your important files and data ... Hope you have a cd burner. U should actually make back ups of your files and data as you get more and more, especially when you're using Windows. So in short; back-up your stuff and reinstall :)

Well I suppose if it worked for you Hurricane, all the better.

Like I say, I still don't believe what Microsoft is saying. Then again over half the patches they claim work don't. And as I said above, I don't feel this is a caching problem.

But either way, theres no harm in trying.

Originally posted by 80sSmurf


I'm surprised you never heard this term before Aaron ... BSOD = Blue Screen Of Death .... I don't think I need to explain what that is ;) :D

BTW I'm just like you're friend. When WinME finally crashes (which is just as inevitable as death and taxes) I too will run a fdisk and start a clean install ... I don't have too much faith in M$ as it is, and I'm sure just reinstalling isn't gonna cut it, too many quirks and instability will follow in the slipstream of the reinstall :)

DAVID!!!
It's very important that you back up all your important files and data ... Hope you have a cd burner. U should actually make back ups of your files and data as you get more and more, especially when you're using Windows. So in short; back-up your stuff and reinstall :)

Oh ok I've heard of blue screen of death, but you are literally the first person who has called it BSOD.

The ONLY versions of Windows I've seen go multiple years without crashing is NT and 2000. Well thats not entirely true, our gateway at work is 98 and we have not reinstalled in a couple of years, but then again, ALL it does is acts as a gateway. There is NEVER a user on it.

A reinstall won't permanately fix any errors. The deal is, when you reinstall corrupt files, the old files are rarely deleted. Sometimes you just have to start over. I know this is true because I have desperately tried to fix a Windows machine that was on its last legs and its just about impossible with a format and a reinstall.

Well not to keep rehashing this, but I asked my friend about the write behind caching deal. I have never heard of this bug. I am using both 98 and 2000. He said it was a known bug. Ok so what do I do? I go to google and search for this. Only Windows 2000 came back as having the problem. 98 never showed up.

Also, it only happens under certain systems. I've used 98 and 2000 on over 15 different machines and never seen this before.

The main reason why I said I don't think the caching will fix this is because Boggle never mentioned shutting down. That's why I don't see this as a caching problem.

The other thing I have a big problem with is whenever Microsoft puts out patches they claim fig well known bugs. I honestly can't remember the last major patch that WORKED. I have installed every service pack I have seen to fix every known security problem, and to this day, they constantly release new patches to address previous known issues.

In other words, they can't seem to fix their own bugs. This is why I don't understand why users download their patches and actually believe all the problems noted are fixed.

Doesn't hurt to download them, but if the problem keeps coming back in different forms, do you really believe them?

There is a known shutdown bug on many machines. I did a refresh install on 98 on mine and installed every critical update. Did it fix mine? Nope. This is exactly why I don't believe Microsoft and their supposed updates. Just a bunch of crap.

I ran SFC and it found close to 10 corrupt files and corrected them. I ran a thorough Scandisk and it found no errors. As for Windows, I just had it reinstalled recently and several times in the past. It still doesn't fix the problem.

Something I just noticed is you never said WHICH version of Windows you are using. 95, 98, NT, 2000, XP???

I assume 98 or 98 SE.

To give you an idea how much Windows SUCKS and how unstable 98 SE is, I have a separate boot drive that ALL I use it for is video capture. That's it. I have a firewall and exploder so I can use the internet. Otherwise, it's purely for video capture. After I capture about 2 movies and try to reboot my machine, I immediately get a GPF and the blue screen from hell.

I just installed this copy less than 2 weeks ago. In fact, RIGHT after I installed it, I was STILL getting the updates, Windows crashed on me.

And like I've said, my system is not a cheap one. My motherboard alone is an Asus, which is one of the better boards out there. Asus board with Intel CPU and chipset.

Windows just sucks. I quit trying to figure out what causes all the problems long ago. It's just a buggy operating system.

Well, there is a stable OS out there, and I'm surprised you haven't mentioned it in this discussion. Have you tried Linux yet? That OS is very stable. A friend of mine works at a bank that hasn't rebooted their Linux server in over 3 1/2 years! :D

Originally posted by Hurricane
Well, there is a stable OS out there, and I'm surprised you haven't mentioned it in this discussion. Have you tried Linux yet? That OS is very stable. A friend of mine works at a bank that hasn't rebooted their Linux server in over 3 1/2 years! :D

Hurricane... you don't read past threads much, do you? :lol:

I have overstated Linux many, many times. Just ask Shakey or Smurfie. :)

When I say I wish there was a stable OS, I usually am referring to any version of Windows.

True I haven't mentioned it in THIS discussion, but I have brought it up many times already. Look through the threads in here. You will see what an advocate I am for Linux.

Yep. No need to preach the values of Linux here. I think that most of the regulars to this forum all agree that Linux is a good OS. Mandrake currently resides on one of my three partitions.